How is this possible? (a rant)

[ASLNROX]

Toby,

You are right on. Not only does Ikea (etc.) furniture fall apart, BUT I can not get the WOOD for what they sell a finished product. How is this possible, it is not the high prices of wood, it is the source. Much of the "budget" furniture woods finds their genesis in the rain forests. There is lots of wood there, but at the rate it is being harvested to make "furniture" will create a environmental crisis that the world has yet to see.

And all because the market demands "cheap" furniture that has a five year useful life... and for this a tree gave its all. A shame.

Blessings,
--Mark

[center]http://garageshop.org/SignIcon.jpg
[center][link:garageshop.org/ | Visit the Shop]

[TDHofstetter]

We, the elite, have gathered here today to engage in a plot to undermine the whole of our consumerist society. It is our mission to bear forth with us the skills and willingness to use tools, and to make things with those tools, and to repair things with those tools, in direct defiance of social expectation. We are the radicals. We are the counterculture. We represent a silent revolution (until somebody fires up their friggin' portable planer in the middle of the night, that is). :) :) :)

Yeah. I like it here. I like it here quite a lot. :) :) :)

-- Tim --

Crow ain't so bad
Once you get the hang of
the recipe

:)

[arcticfox46]

Built in obsolesence??? OR It it really what capitalism is all about??

My dad was a smart man - he told me once that it is best to work in a place that makes disposable items that it is to work in a place that makes durable items

Here's an example - Olin (ever heard of them?) owned Winchester. That's the gun company. Winchester was at ont time autonomous - solely owned and operated by Wnichester. Olin bought the company and operated them for a while - then decided to seperate the bullet manufacturing and sell off the gun manufacturing. Three guesses??? Bullets are disposable and are profitable - guns are neither.

Point #2 Gillett makes disposable razors - BIG company - BIG money.

If manufacturers make an item for sale and make it to last forever - you will NEVER come back and buy another one. Once the market is filled up - there is no more market and the company goes out of business.

If a manufacturer makes an item that lasts for a few years - you will come back in a few years and buy ANOTHER one - company continues to make money and stays in business.

SOFTWARE companies are the BIGGEST culprits at built in obsolence

McAffee said to an interviewer years ago, when asked why he GIVE away his software - ans, I will get the money back and more on upgrades.

[dcarter636]

So when do I get my double secret subversive decoder ring? :)

[tbragsdale]

Capitalism also works when consumers demand better from the market. If a good is needed, and if we take what we get without question the quality, they will sacrifice that quality till we demand more, or another offers better.

The points about planed obsolescence are all very true. The discussion of capitalism, true also, but my rant also about how we convince our selves to make due with inferior goods. Its about where our breaking point is. If I can produce the same product with no skill to speak of, no specialized tools to speak of, and that product preforms better than others on the market, the logical question is, in a capitalistic economy, how are these manufactures still in business?

How about the Chinese drill example. I might be able to make a drill. I cant make a drill of superior quality to what no-brand Chinese do, so I buy.

Among other things, the rant is how we choose to feel helpless in the face of mass-production, and consumerism. I choose to purchase what I need or want, and try to pay little attention to what they tell me I need or want.

TBR

[tbragsdale]

Mark,

It is shameful. Since I just was typing capitalism , and the subject came up, I feel that the TOTAL cost of anything needs to be considered. Just because you can rip a tree out of the ground, mill it, and produce the wood for X dollars, that can not, doesn't cover the total cost for that product. There MUST be built in systems to the manufacture to cover the lifetime cost of their raw material, and the end of life of that product.

When it comes to trees, we all can admit to being zealots. I don't think many woodworkers would mind paying more for lumber for the additional ecological concerns, if it insures the chance that the species can contune.

TBR

[rrich]

>I may hate these abominations of
>pine, but they STILL hold books, or whatever they were
>intended to.
>
>
Amazing, isn't it? Yes, I hate the bookshelf I made in '75 or '76. I finished it with penetrating stain to make good pine look like walnut and a couple of final coats of polyurethane. Still, it looks better than the stuff that I can buy today AND it still holds books.

Today we can't get the good pine or the stain!

I had a bunch more stuff in this post but in the interest of keeping Marc's lock and key someplace else... Enough, enough Rich, enough!

[CajunRider]

On the other side of things....

When I was in Germany, a German friend told me:
"I have this 30yr old washer, it still works perfectly. I'm so ready for it to die so I can buy a newer one with more features."

That really sticks with me --> "features".

[bobha8]

I just had my first experience with ikea stuff. My BIL had me help him put together a dining table and a coffee/storage table. They were quite proud of it ( they're the yuppie type). I told my wife on the way home I made stuff better than that crap when all I had was a circlular saw and a drill! (sounds famillar doesn't it)

The problem is though they through the Ikea name around like it was quality and everyone wants/ or has it in their circle. It sounds like this demographic thinks this is a good product and something to be proud of.

We live in a much smaller area than they do but we have a very nice house with what I consider very nice furniture it's all either made by me or amish made or similar quality all kinda rustic. I will not buy junk now that I can afford not to. My SIL doesn't like our furinture much and she has commented she doesn't like the look of wood much so maybe that's it? cause none of that Ikea crap they bought even resemble wood. heck we have nice solid oak paneling in some places of our house and she said she would paint it!

So I guess what I am saying is alot is demagraphics. most people where I live in small town Pa would rather have a better quality. and It sounds like her cirle of freinds in the Cleveland area would rather buy crap!
Maybe now I can see why the browns can never beat the Steelers!

[dcarter636]

That reminds me of when my brother was in the navy. While he was at sea his wife went out and bought a bedroom set made of SOLID KNOTTY PINE!!!
She was so proud and excited to have real wooden furniture while little brother was seething that she spent all their money on poorly built soft wood furniture; he had worked in a good refinishing shop all through high school and had been thoroughly exposed to fine furniture.

If you grow up with particle board, Ikea might seem like good stuff.